Thursday Threads

We have a couple of LIV retrospectives to sort through as well as an Ask Alan, but first a Big Cat Sighting...

What Off-Season? - Not only does he have a birthday coming up, but he apparently intends to play quite a bit of golf in December:

f it feels like it’s been a while since you last saw Tiger Woods hit a golf shot, that’s because it has been a while. It’s been nearly four months since his teary-eyed walk up the 18th fairway at St.

Andrews. That absence is coming to an end, and Tiger fans need wait just a couple more weeks.

Woods is joining the limited field in his own event, the Hero World Challenge, later this month at Albany in the Bahamas, just one week prior to playing in another edition of The Match with teammate Rory McIlroy against Jordan Spieth and Justin Thomas.

That officially makes the month of December “Tiger Woods Season.” Thank you for waiting so patiently. Woods announced the news Wednesday on Twitter, as well as the additions of Kevin Kisner and Tommy Fleetwood to the 20-man lineup.

Well, sure, since it's an Elevated Event.... More to the point, I assume that he'll have to walk the course in the Hero.  But missing from this item is that other event Tiger is expected to play in December, a certain team event.

For instance, I was saddened to see his putative partner playing in a junior event saddled with a caddie that can barely walk:

Tiger's good buddy Notah Begay was touched by seeing the spawn bombing it, and posted this sentimental tweet:

In Jr golf @TigerWoods & I started out almost 40yrs ago! Now to watch Charlie playing at a competitive level is wonderful! pic.twitter.com/GwZ8t0wknu

— Notah Begay III (@NotahBegay3) November 9, 2022

I don't usually give in to the treacly stuff, but it's awfully sweet.  But weird how he posted those photos, because you'll want to see the old buddies back in the day:

Tiger's nickname on the Stanford Golf Team (which, of course, included) Notah, was Urkel, which I totally get.  But I'm kinda curious as to what Notah's nickname might have been.

LIV, A Retrospective - Two Golfweek pieces attempt to capture the LIV zeitgeist, first this Adam Woodard assessment of winners and losers, which starts with this dubious "W":

Winner – Fans looking for something new

Whether you enjoy it or not, LIV Golf offers something new to the traditional 72-hole stroke play

tournaments that fans see week-to-week on various tours. There’s a market for the soon-to-be-league, it just depends on what you want from a golf tournament.

If you’re a golf fan who loves the game for history and competition, these events may not be for you. But if you’re a fringe golf or general sports fan who loves festivals and fanfare, you may be interested.

There’s music playing throughout the day and plenty of options in the fan village to keep your attention if the on-course action isn’t doing it, such as varying food and drink options (Greg Norman’s alcohol brand, included), a kids zone, golf activities ranging from putting and chipping challenges to mini golf and even a performance center loaded with multiple digital hitting bays and video games.

You almost forget you’re at a golf tournament.

That's certainly a take....For me, I would try to evaluate that on two bases, first a subjective evaluation of the innovations themselves, coupled with an assessment of the impact.

I'm an old curmudgeon and pretty much hate all these guys, so you'll shocked to know that the life-altering change from 72 to 54 holes of stroke play leaves me indifferent, at best.  But the new that they do actually offer, the team competition, doesn't even warrant a mention?  

But can this be "winner" if it's a tree in the forest?  Virtually no one saw these events either live or on TV, so there seemingly should be a demerit there.

But this second item, compiled by the same Adam Woodard, has some interesting bits from a panel of golf writers at various publications, so let's drop on that music bit:

What did you make of LIV Golf’s first year?

“I attended the LIV Golf events at Pumpkin Ridge, Rich Harvest Farms and Trump National Doral, albeit from a news-gathering position and not so much the actual golf. It was one heck of a party everywhere I went. The atmosphere was decidedly different from what I’ve seen at the majors and PGA Tour events. I’m not saying that’s necessarily a good thing, but it was definitely different. There was music on the driving range, practice green and around the course. Players definitely seemed more relaxed. One thing that was missing was the tension in the air that you can feel at a major or big PGA Tour event.” — Mark Schlabach, ESPN

Yeah, as happy as I am that the players are digging the music on the range, that last bit seems the crux of LIV's issues.  Guys are always relaxed when they're playing Pro-Ams and exhibitions.

But I think Schlabach is slightly off on limitng himself to big-time PGA Tour events.  There's always pressure and tension at any PGA Tour event, because the guys are playing for their careers.   It's just that the tension is provided from players further down the rankings lists, and therein lies the rub.

But see if you can square this circle:

Winner – LIV players

During just the regular season, of the 68 players to tee it up, a whopping 48 players made more than $1 million, with 15 making more than $4 million over LIV’s first seven events. Dustin

Johnson, LIV’s inaugural regular-season champion, blew away the field thanks to $10,575,267 in individual earnings for a $13,637,767 total with his 4Aces team prizes included.

That’s without last week’s team championship money, where the payouts ranged from $1 million to the four teams who lost in the quarterfinals to the $16 million paid out to Johnson’s victorious 4Aces.

Getting paid more to work less is a massive win, but more on that to come.

Yeah, I get where it's pretty sweet for them...., but:

Loser – LIV players

You can’t talk about LIV Golf for very long without talking about the money and its controversial source. With Saudi Arabia’s Public Investment Fund as its sole funder, LIV Golf has long been criticized as a way for the Kingdom to sportswash its human rights record. Saudi Arabia has been accused of wide-ranging human rights abuses, including politically motivated killings, torture, forced disappearances and inhumane treatment of prisoners. Not to mention members of the royal family and Saudi government were accused of involvement in the murder of Jamal Khashoggi, a Saudi journalist and Washington Post columnist.

When players left the PGA and DP World tours to join the breakaway, they did so knowing their reputations may take a hit. They knew they would compromise their chances to compete in not only team competitions like the Ryder Cup and Presidents Cup, but also the majors due to LIV events lacking OWGR points. Harold Varner III was one of the few to be honest and rational about the situation.

“For me, I think we knew what we were getting into. I think it’s easy to sit here and say what could happen, what should happen. But obviously, for me, I knew what was going to happen,” said Varner, who’s known to tell it like it is. “I knew exactly what was going to happen. I knew what could happen in my career and I accept that.”

Players have lost a lot, from sponsors to the chance to etch their name into the game’s history, but that’s what the big money is supposed to make up for.

Woodard is pretty bad at this, isn't he?  He's painting with an awfully broad brush, and I would spend much psychic energy thinking that many of these guys care about the majors any more.  And, really, if you're Graeme McDowell (who actually said that LIV is golf without the grind) or Lee Westwood, your career is effectively over, so why not cash the big check?

I think there's a larger point to be made about DJ, Cameron and the young turks opting out of the grind of Tour life, and I'll be interested to see how those careers might evolve without that competitive juice.  But I also find it interesting that the only reputational hit he can see if taking the blood money.  These guys have screwed the Tour that brought them to prominence, impairing the economic environment for those making their way out on Tour, as well as violating the terms of sponsorship agreements.  That seems a rather big deal to this observer.

Care to see how they handle this one?

Was LIV Golf successful in year one?

“I think it depends how you define success. I was at The Genesis in February when LIV Golf seemed dead in the water. One by one, top players made commitments to the PGA Tour, whether it was through interviews or statements. For LIV Golf to secure the number of top players it did, especially Cameron Smith, Dustin Johnson, Bryson DeChambeau and Joaquin Niemann, has to be considered a success. But the lack of a TV network or major streaming deal and its audience metrics for the first eight events have to be alarming for Greg Norman and LIV executives. No matter how they spin the numbers, there just doesn’t seem to be a large audience of golf fans watching.” — Schlabach

In that last sentence, I'd have put the period before "watching."  But this one seems an early call at best:

Winner – Greg Norman

A two-time Open champion and 20-time winner on Tour, Norman’s company has been involved

in various ventures since his playing days, from course design to apparel and alcohol. His shirts are still being worn at PGA Tour events, despite the fact the former world No. 1 has been at odds with the Tour even before LIV, dating back to his failed attempt to create a world golf tour in 1994.

“He has basically found people to fund his vendetta against the PGA Tour,” said McIlroy to the Guardian on Norman. “I think he hides behind ‘force for good’ and all that stuff. … This has been his dream for 30 years, and he has finally found people who can fund that dream.”

LIV has put Norman’s name back in the spotlight, and that’s precisely where he wants to be. Backlash be damned, that’s a win in his book and wallet.

Norman's cry for relevance has been temporarily sated, but I'd be awfully hesitant to declare victory at this point.  The next few months will be interesting in that regard, but right now I don't him sitting with especially good hole cards (with the minor exception of that checkbook).

This is interesting as well:

Can LIV and the PGA/DP World Tours co-exist?

 A couple of the writers seem to get it:

“I don’t think so. Not so much because of the rhetoric, people have said much worse and come together in business. But the schedule with 14 events, the shotgun starts, the 54 hole events … it would take a lot of concessions for LIV to form and alliance and I am not sure if they are willing, especially if they poach a few more big names.” — D’Angelo

Forget everything in there except for the number fourteen, because that drives everything... Here's a longer version thereof:

“In a technical sense, they can coexist the way that roughly they are right now. LIV has a few players, the PGA Tour has a few players, the PGA Tour becomes weaker, the DP World Tour becomes weaker, and LIV just kind of gradually collects more and more players. That can kind of go on for a while and that is a kind of coexistence. But when people talk about some kind of formal cooperation between the PGA and DP World Tours and LIV, I don’t know what the hell they’re talking about.

LIV has players under contract to play 14 events a year, and presumably the top players will want to play for majors on top of that. That’s 18 events. That’s almost as many events as most of the best players in the world want to play in a given year, and I’m talking about top 20, top 30 players here. They don’t play many more events than that. They play somewhere between that kind of 18 to 25 event load. There are outliers like Patrick Reed and Sungjae Im, who might play a few more, but that’s what they’re looking for. They’re looking to settle right around 20, 21, 22 events in a year. So if LIV is going to have players required to play 14 events in a year, then I don’t see how there can possibly be any kind of official cooperation between LIV and the PGA and DP World Tours, because what does that look like? The LIV player plays 14 events and then plays four majors and then plays three PGA Tour events or three DP World Tour events and that’s the whole schedule? That’s not cooperation at all, or at least it’s not the cooperation of equals. I think people just need to think this through a little bit when they’re talking about LIV and the PGA Tour making a deal, because clearly players can’t really play on both leagues. That can’t happen. Both tours, both sides want most of the best players in the world, because that’s the way that they’re going to be profitable. They can’t be profitable unless they have most of the best players in the world. That’s true in the PGA Tour’s case. That’s true in LIV’s case, and players can’t really play on both. So when people go on about coexistence, again, I feel like I’m taking crazy pills. What does that actually look like?” — Morrison

Some of my beast laughs re when someone says, Jay should have cut a deal with them at the start.... When someone tells you that they want to drink your milkshake, take them seriously.

I'd also remind you that LIV has no interest in the Fall or early winter, so they will be fighting over that Jan./Feb/-Aug./Sept. turf for as long as the Saudis want to keep writing checks.

Don't know about you, dear reader, but i can certainly use a palate cleanser....

Alan, Asked - It's not a LIV-free zone, but at least there's some distractions to be found.  As worn out by LIV as I am, I couldn't help but laugh at this

Do you think LIV Golf will offer Charlie Woods more than $500 million? #AskAlan @JonathonJFelix

I can’t believe I’m actually typing this but Charlie Woods is, in today’s marketplace, the most valuable golfer in the world. We’re already obsessed with him, and his journey through golf will include his dad as coach, caddie, bodyguard, head cheerleader, sports psychologist and sundry other roles. He’s a great-looking kid with cross-cultural roots, a fascinating backstory and one of the most famous last names in sports. Half a billion would be a bargain for LIV.

So, Alan, remind me who Charlie's legal guardian is.... and what did said legal guardian do when he was offered half a billion large?  But, yeah, fun question.

Another fun one:

More likely to win 5 majors—Scheff, Morikawa, JT? @Blulinski

This time last year Morikawa would have been the easy choice but, as we’ve seen, a lot can change in one season. He clearly regressed in ’22 but I liked Morikawa’s recent fire responding to Trevor Immelman’s critique. And the first step on the road to recovery is admitting you have a problem; that Morikawa recently hired his first-ever putting coach hints at a big rebound next year. Justin Thomas has a gear that neither of these other players possess but he remains a tad too flighty. It will take a career to get to five majors, and JT seems to get beaten down by the nadirs. Can he keep pushing through? I love everything about Scheffler but he’s been a world-class player for only about a year. I need more more of a sample size before anointing him. I mean, five majors is a monumental number. We’re talking Seve and Lord Byron territory. I’m not sure any current player other that Rory McIlroy will get there. (I guess Brooks Koepka has to be in the conversation, too, if only because he’s already at four.) But to your question, I’ll take Morikawa.

Rory?  Maybe, but that next one seems awfully make-or-break to me.  I actually have a Morikawa item, but doubt I'll get to it today.  I'm still trying to figure out how good Scottie really is so, like Alan, I'd go with Collin just because of his 2-1 lead.

I think we need more info on the Bubba front. Surely, if he received these kinds of appearance fees, he wasn’t alone. And I can’t imagine that if such appearance fees were being given, it would have had “open secret” status. Is this something you knew about before his comments? @GolfSpyMPR

Yes, it has been know to golf insiders for forever that PGA Tour sponsors find ways to put money in the pockets of players they want to tee it up at their tournament. It’s such an accepted practice that Bubba’s comments got no pushback from any players on the PGA Tour, and the Tour itself actually confirmed it! The classic “sponsor-related activity” is to show up at a cocktail party and press flesh for half an hour, or perhaps do a little Q and A. It’s not exactly heavy lifting and I’ve heard number as high as $300,000 for these de facto appearance fees.

Isn't this pretty much a nothingburger?  I mean, they're signing nine-figure deals with bonecutters, and we're worried that Bubba got some pocket change for shaking hands at a sponsor's event?

Alan, we feel your pain:

Does your phone auto suggest Janewattananond at this point or do you take pride in properly typing it out? #AskAlan @JWilliams263

Honestly, I cut and paste it every time. It took me a solid five years to have confidence in Schauffele and Oosthuizen!

This is now a lay-up:

Are there certain tea leaves you guys in media can read in terms what players from pga are leaving for LIV? Are there certain events/obligations that if player shows up (or doesn’t show up) that gives you a clue? How do you know what to look for other than official announcement? @KeithKhorton

After nearly a year of being surrounded by rumors, subterfuge, mixed signals, retractions, pump fakes, waffling and flat-out guesswork, I’ve learned one thing to always be true about the LIV rumors: no one knows what the hell they’re talking about. Until a player is officially announced by LIV Golf, and actually shows up at one of its events, everything is subject to renegotiation and change-of-heart and all the noise is meaningless.

Pretty much.

Do you ever foresee a PGA/LPGA mixed teams tournament? And which would you prefer for the format, alternate shot or best-ball? #AskAlan @thestables1896

This is the biggest no-brainer in all of golf and that it hasn’t happened yet is an indictment of the leadership of both tours. If it ever comes to pass, I hope they go all-in on the format: one round each of best-ball, alternate shot, worst-shot scramble and both-balls-count. It would instantly be must-see TV.

He's right, but good luck with that worst-ball scramble....

Thing is, the reason something like this hasn't happened is mostly FedEx.  The huge rewards associated with that have calcified the Tour, guys simply won't show up if there's no FedEx Cup points on offer.  They struggled even to accommodate the Zurich team event, but this makes sense for the reimagined Fall schedule, when and if that happens.

This to me seems an especially stupide Q&A:

If for whatever reason Cantlay and Xander aren’t available for the Ryder Cup… how significantly does that improve Europe’s chances? @feralgolfer

The U.S. side is very, very deep but losing two of the best players in the world, who happen to be close friends and a powerhouse duo at the most recent Presidents Cup, would be a huge blow. Barring a sea change, the Americans will already have to do without Dustin Johnson, who went 5-0 at the last Ryder Cup. Europe has a powerful home field advantage—if Cantlay and Schauffele go LIV, the U.S. would lose its status as the favorites in Rome.

Well, yeah, but....I just don't think there's a likely scenario where it's only those two guys that go (and, really, what other scenarios are there where those two are "unavailable").  If those two go, I'm unclear as to whether we'll have a Ryder Cup...

Should excellence in professional golf be determined on a team basis or an individual one? If an individual basis as it has always been historically, then how successful can LIV be? And if LIV seeks to change that, how worried should the Majors be? @2p43Paul

There is definitely a place in the game for team play, and mastery in that format can greatly enhance a player’s reputation; Colin Montgomerie doesn’t make it into the Hall of Fame without his legendary Ryder Cup exploits. But golf has always been the sport of rugged individuals and the majors are where excellence is defined. You’re not going to see team play at the Grand Slam events, so I think this question is settled.

Alan gets it right, but the irony is that those whose reputations have most benefitted from their team play, Westy, Poults and Sergio jump to mind, were the first to turn their backs on it.  Only to grow the game, of course.

Alan, what do you think the PGA Championship will do as far as LIV guys go? Will they allow them to qualify like USGA and R&A will? Will LIV guys play in PGA qualifiers with club pros? @bobbytrunole

Note the word “Open” in the USGA’s and R & A’s signature events. They have always been events that allowed anyone to play their way in. The PGA Championship is a different deal. The whole organization caters to club pros so those spots will always be safeguarded. There’s not going to be open qualifying because that’s not in the tournament’s DNA. There are many ways to play your way into the PGA: winning the Masters, U.S. Open or British Open gets you a 5-year exemption, and those finishing in the top 15 at a PGA Championship are automatically invited the following year. There is also a provision in the tournament bylaws that the PGA of America “reserves the right to invite additional players not included” in its existing qualifying categories, so, other than Jay Monahan’s stink eye, there is nothing to prevent special invites to a handful of LIV guys who might otherwise not be in the field.

This event does have a bit more flexibility, though I expect the LIV guys to be there.  How many of them is the question, because their world rankings are in many cases in freefall.

I've been on this subject as well:

What’s the deal with Rory’s position on LIV? He’s waffling more than a politician. And, is there a split between him and Monahan because this certainly isn’t a united front? @kylelabat

Monahan has been strident and unyielding in public because any hint that his players could slurp up LIV money and still retain Tour membership would lead to an exodus from the PGA Tour. McIlroy picked up on that vibe initially but has slowly become more pragmatic. Since he’s not the Tour’s commissioner—at least not officially—his words can not be construed as policy, so he has more wiggle room. But certainly he has influence and McIlroy’s softening stance is no doubt reflective of what he’s hearing from colleagues, and perhaps even in his regular conversations with Monahan. Who knows, rather than setting himself in opposition to Monahan, he may low-key be doing the Commish’s bidding by laying groundwork for a compromise that reunifies the game.

I think we all get that Rory hates the ongoing battle and the dilution of PGA Tour fields.  That said, i think he's inadvertently giving aid and comfort to the enemy.  We're sitting here at a bit of a crossroads, where absent further defections it doesn't seem that LIV has achieved critical mass.  But if you hem and haw about these guys being brought back into the fold, why shouldn't Patrick or X-Man cash a big check before we all join hands and sing kumbaya?

Why doesn’t the Tour get that it needs to send more money to the feeder tours like Korn Ferry, Latinoameria, etc.? Those kids will become the future stars and could make LIV’s “stars” irrelevant in a few years. But now LIV can pick them for ~$2M, which is chump change to them. But these would be huge losses to the Tour. #askalan @clovercap

The PGA Tour has finite resources. It can’t funnel hundreds of million dollars to its top players *and* double or triple purses on the developmental tours. The math doesn’t work. Right now the Tour is rightfully focused on keeping its stars. But with its $300 million investment in the Asian Tour/International Series, LIV is clearly trying to own the future. The Tour will have to respond at some point soon or it risks losing a generation of young talent. Mark Baldwin went deep on this topic in an insightful new story on FirePitCollective.com.

The Tour is funding a whole series of developmental tours, so I'm unclear what the questioner thinks is the right amount of funding.  But right at the moment, as Alan notes, they're perhaps a little distracted by trying to keep their alpha dogs loyal.

On that note we will conclude.  I am unclear as to whether I'll blog tomorrow, but I do have quite a few open browser tabs....